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Post by schlager7 on Jul 27, 2011 8:33:58 GMT -6
Here are the ROCs for Texas and surriounding states for the 2011-2012 Fencing Year.
10/01/2011 Amarillo Amarillo Open Div 1A, Vet
10/29/2011 New Orleans Crescent City Open Div 1A, Div II, Vet
03/10/2012 Arlington Wang Memorial Div 1A, Div II
04/02/2012 Houston Alice B. Memorial Div II, Vet
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Post by katyblades on Feb 6, 2012 21:30:41 GMT -6
It looks like the policies of the USFA are making themselves felt in the turnout. The GCD hosted a national Div. II qualifier, and the number of fencers were terrible to say the least. There were more fencers for these types of tournaments in the 80s.
There is no use pretending that this is not a result of policies in the division of one of the largest markets in the U.S. Why host a developmental qualifier in a division that does not properly support developmental clubs or fencers? There should have been 50+ epee fencers like last week at the Pouj. There should actually have been more because we could have the base.
We have to assume that these results in numbers are what are desired by the decision-makers. I no longer participate in the process by these rules, but a good quote is "insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results." I know the results would be the same and stopped.
If a club can't pay for floor space with tournaments, (and USFA tournaments are what fencers desire), then they will not participate in the process. Then the results are what we see from last weekend. Four years ago at the Call to Arms my club had 20+ participants from the level that could have competed this past weekend. Each of the clubs could have that, but not with these policies.
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kb
Squire
Posts: 261
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Post by kb on Feb 7, 2012 7:00:33 GMT -6
I'll say this- I was all prepared to go "fence" in the Vet WE, so I could qualify for SNs in Dallas. I put quotes around that b/c I haven't been at class in the last 4 months-but that would have been remedied by the time SN came around. But thanks to SN being in California...well, that's money I didn't need to spend right now. I think the Vet events would have been better attended if we were still going to Dallas.
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Post by seguin on Feb 7, 2012 10:03:19 GMT -6
I'm sorry, but I'm not following your argument. Granted, I'm in Dallas.
What policies in Gulf Coast do you think has led to the small turnout? The last year or two has also seen noticeable drop offs in tournaments in North Texas (Dallas and Ft. Worth being no small market either). Do you see a corollary between the policies of the respective divisions?
Also the Pouj only had 58 competitors in senior mixed epee, generally their largest event by far. Only a few years ago, numbers in the 75-85 were not uncommon (IIRC).
I'm not saying whether or not you may have policies that need changing down your way (that may very well be), but I think the more salient fact is simply that we are 3 years into a very sluggish economy and people are being more cautious in their discretionary spending. Spectator turnout at professional sports, performing arts, restuarants and cinemas is also down compared to what it was a few years before the current economic meltdown.
I see a bit of improvement compared to the previous year or two, but I think it will be awhile until we see numbers like we did in the early 2000s.
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Post by katyblades on Feb 9, 2012 17:13:26 GMT -6
You could probably look up KON's posts to get a more reasonable explanation.
1. Each club has to pay for floor space to afford to have a location. Tournaments are the best way to do that. It is also the best way to integrate beginner's into the USFA. If a local club can't do a monthly tournament for its student base, then the people are not integrated. They stop fencing.
The local GCD policy is to not allow these tournaments in a frequency to allow for this growth. It has been that policy for years.
Don't look at limiting opportunities to increase growth, increase the number of fencers.
As a good baseline: I won the Duel at Dallas in 1988 in foil and epee. (95 foil and 65 epee)
I also won the Van Buskirk foil and 3rd in epee, (congrats Al Peters 12-11), 92 in foil and 67 in epee.
I know that there were not nearly as many clubs, coaches, locations, teachers or participants. We have more USFA members in the GCD than we had when I was section chair in 1987, and the Southwest Section was the fastest growing section in the US and only trailed the New York and California sections in size.
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