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Post by charley on Feb 21, 2006 18:13:06 GMT -6
I noticed in a fencing.net thread today a comment by schlager7 about lunette guards for french foils.
I would be very interested in trying one out -- is there an individual or company who produces good reproductions?
Also, I'd imagine that they would change the balance of the weapon. Would one need different weight pommels?
thanks,
charley
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Post by schlager7 on Feb 21, 2006 20:16:54 GMT -6
There's at least one classical group that markets lunettes. I could also ask Nicole how much she'd charge for one.
As to weight, there is a shift, but remember that while the openings contribute zero weight, most lunettes are bronze and weigh more than modern aluminum round guards.
(I suppose there might be aluminum lunettes out in the world, but I've never seen one.)
Just FYI - TCA markets a clamshell guard designed by Adam Crown.
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Post by Parry Nine on Feb 21, 2006 23:18:56 GMT -6
What is a lunette ? What's it look like, etc?
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Post by schlager7 on Feb 22, 2006 8:19:28 GMT -6
It is a type of foil guard popular in the 19th Century and the very beginning of the 20th Century. Basically it is shaped like a figure-8. As such, it resembled a type of eyeglasses design popular in the Victorian era that was also called "lunette," which (I suppose) means "little moons." An just FYI, a "clamshell" guard thus referes to a foil guard that looks rather like lunettes, but has the open area of the "8" filled in. In my understanding, the evolution ran something like this: As the smallsword displaced the rapier in England and France, small oval and clamshell-shaped guards predominated. As the foil was the training tool of the smallsword fencer/duellist, its guard mirrored that of the smallsword. For instructional purposes, a figure-8 framework eventually superceded the clamshell, because it allowed students to observe the doighte' (fingerwork) of the instructor. Conversely, in the hands of students, the instructor could monitor their progress in the proper handling and manipulation of the weapon. As far as I know, the figure-8/lunette guard never had an existence beyond the classroom. [Aside to charley: If you want one, Nicole thinks she could make/sell one for about $20.00... She said she'd have to double-check the current price of bronze to be certain.] If you go here www.tcasfencing.com/Page5.jpgAll of the foils except #52 and #86 on the bottom row have lunette guards. Some show leather clamshell pads mounted behind the lunette guards. (In free-fencing and competition this prevents the opponent's blade from getting tangled inside the openings. Now for your trivia, can you identify the guard type in #52 & #86?
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Post by Dan Gorman on Feb 22, 2006 12:11:01 GMT -6
Italian.
Dan
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Post by schlager7 on Feb 22, 2006 12:21:55 GMT -6
Points for Dan!
Although (and this is cheating a bit) #52 is actually an odd and blissfully-extinct variant of Italian known, at the time, as a German grip/guard. It is similar to an Italian, except that the guard is so shallow and the rings so small you can not actually get your finger between the crossbar and guard, nor fit them within the rings.
In fact from the few people I have ever corresponded with who actually encountered them, they were considered far and away among the worst design ideas ever to hit the fencing community. They had pretty much evaporated by the First World War, although a few stragglers turned up as late as the mid-1930s.
Apparantly the construction was such that it was difficult to find a useful and comfortable place to put your index finger or thumb.
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